The Midnight Hour

Wow that is a great summary of how I’ve felt for sometime. I hate the though of voting for the lesser of two evils. It seems like that’s what a lot of people do in every election cycle. It is a completely failed system, but it won’t ever change until we, the voters, make it change by changing our behavior.

Ronald, glad to hear there are like-minded people out there. However, I actually expect this to piss-off the majority of my readers. We’ll see.

I think a greater percentage of Republicans are voting to keep someone else out of office than Democrats voting to put someone in office.

That is, I think the Republicans aren’t really a party of Republicans but rather a party of “Not Democrats”, “Not Liberals”, and “Not Obama”.

Likewise I think some percentage of Democrats are really a party of “Not Republicans” and “Not Evangelical Conservatives”. However, I feel that the Republicans are voting to keep someone out of office. I mean, this is what radio media has been doing for two years. How great is John McCain? Rush and Hannity haven’t shut-up about Obama long enough to tell me.

I think your “7 Questions” will prove that. Either it proves that McCain supporters are selling out and voting to keep someone out of office OR those proud supporters of John McCain must look themselves in the mirror and openly call themselves “Neo Conservatives”. They must also swallow the fact that they are not like the Conservative movements in prior decades.

a very good assesment of the intolerable situation we find ourselves in. Thank you Public schools and left leaning higher institutions and colleges that are continuously lowering the depth, amount, historical/factual/reasoned learning methods that prevents/robs the next generations from maximizing their indiviual educational journey tht has kept this country at the cutting edge for a century. Like the frog in the pot of cold water that slowly comes to a boil…. and the frogs demise!

I think you’re right on. A McCain win would result in long-term change of the direction of the Republican party - which is arguably more harmful - than 4 years of an Obama presidency.

Additionally, I think that on some level it’s just not right to be parity to something that doesn’t reflect your values, independent of what the consequences are. Whatever is going to happen is going to happen, but I don’t want to be responsible for it.

This is why I re-registered as an Independant and dropped from the Republican party. We as a people should look long and hard at our two party system and realize how ineffective it truly is. We need more of a variety in our choice of elected officials.

It is not a zero sum game, politics. No president is flawless, no conservative is ‘perfect’.

And pretty much the same strategy / logic may have resulted in 2 terms of Bill Clinton. Along with a Janet Reno Justice department, and Gingsberg and Breyer on Supreme Court.

W Bush, for his flaws, made solid picks in Roberts and Alito.

No one can predict who McCain would nominate to high court, but I think we could guess the leanings of those from Obama?

Any more Second Amendment rulings going to come down the pike? How about property rights cases? Hmmm.

Don’t vote, vote. In the big picture, it really does not matter - Your (one) vote won’t make a difference anyway. It ain’t the movie “Swing Vote” this year! Heh.

Type your comment here.
If you consider the bad things that can happen to our country under an Obama Presidency through his action or failure to act and make the same judgement for McCain,to me there is no choice. As bad as things might get from McCain’s actions/inactions, I believe we could recover in time. With Obama, I am not sure we could. He could literally be the death of us. I am saddened to vote on that basis but I believe there is no choice

I’ve heard the “it’s too dangerous” and “SCOTUS appointee” argument before. I’m engaging the 300m targets. You guys are focused on the 50m targets.

Jay, does anyone’s vote count more than “one?” Just curious whether you’ve got a point with that one or if you’re just wasting storage space on my blog.

In the big picture my state is so in the tank for McCain that everyone I lay eyes on in a week could vote for Obama and it wouldn’t make a difference.

Still curious if anyone wants to answer the questions.

1. yes
2. absolutely not

@ Possum, I see the point you’re trying to make. But I think you’re being short-sighted. Yes, 4 years of Obama would be bad. In the short run. However, electing McCain might set a precedent that could prove to be devastating in the long run.

Besides, you’re missing the point. The two party system is broken. And it’s not going to change until we do something about it. As diverse as this country is, we should have a more diverse set of (read: MORE) candidates to choose from. We’re like a horse with blinders on. As long as we keep ascribing to a broken system, we’ll only go in the direction it dictates, and that’s a dangerous path to go down…

>> got a point with that one or if you’re just wasting storage space on my blog

Jeff, sorry to waste any space on your blog. But you A) invite comments (’Take a moment to comment and tell us what you think’) and B) You titled this blog post ‘Seven Questions for McCain Voters’.

I apologize for not walking thru your exact decision tree precisely. And if you dislike feedback that is not totally in line with yours, delete me = space problem solved. It is your blog (and a great one), but you seem to be thin skinned at times when commenters are not totally 100% in agreement with you. You are inviting comments and discussion, right?

I was making a larger point to many of us who take the same line of questioning you offered: What’s the value of a vote, either way - or not voting at all? Yeah, I was being snarky with the “one” vote, but you reinforced the point by conceding your state is over the edge towards McCain. So what difference does it make?

We live in a duality: we’re told how important it is to vote, your vote matters, etc. But we also tend to think that OUR one vote is so all important, all the hand wringing, self importance, etc. Blah.

So, before I’m put in the bit bucket, I’ll answer your 7th question: I would not take the logic all that far, since I agree with you that a ‘none of the above’ protest vote (not voting at all) can be effective strategically to send the message, that two bad choices are not the only alternatives.

But I as went thru the calculus with MY vote, I’ve decided to pull the lever for McCain.

Now, could you please expand on what are 50m targets vs 300m? S. 1805 is a 50m, but Supreme Court nominations are 300m…?

I am not thin-skinned with people that disagree with me. Look at my constant disagreements/discussions with Jason, which are both lengthy and civil. However, I am quick to rebuff those who make snide comments directed at me. What we say matters, even on the internet. If you decide to be a smart-ass then I can be a smart-ass too. My comment about “wasting space” is because you specifically pointed out that my one vote doesn’t even matter, and did it as if it invalidates my reasoning. This agitates me because
1. The same argument can be said about your vote for McCain, so it’s a wash. Neither of our votes change the election.
2. The tone of the remark indicated that my opinion doesn’t matter. If it doesn’t matter then I question why you read it.

S. 1805 is an example of McCain not being a conservative. That’s it. It’s not relevant in our discussion of short and long term goals.

The long-term destruction of conservative presidential candidates is the 300m target. You are focused on the bad things that will happen over the next four years in an Obama presidency. Yes, SCOTUS justices are important. No, I’m not willing to concede my principles because the next president will probably appoint a SCOTUS justice. I am focused on the bad things that will happen to conservative thinking and voting in America as a result of McCain being elected. I would rather have real conservatives in the White House and in congress after a destructive Obama presidency than a continued string of pseudo-conservatives that don’t deliver.

Thanks for answering the question. I am mostly curious about how far conservative McCain voters will apply their logic, and your answer gives me some insight.

RE: long-term destruction of conservative presidential candidates is the 300m target.

I see that point, yes.

There is an opinion around that conservatives should accept an Obama win (vote for him, or don’t vote at all), to let things melt down so badly that a replacement could (easily) un-seat him next time around (Carter-Reaganesque scenario)

Don’t want to drag this too far off of your original course, but maybe some time you would care to share attributes / examples of the conservative you would support with your vote?

You mentioned in your post “fiscal conservatism, limited government, and individual liberty” But who around has those credentials?! (I’d like you to vote sometime in the next 100 years!)

Limited government is totally off the radar for the voting public, huh?! Heck, the answer to every single issue today seems to be to run to the Feds (bail outs, gas prices, global warming, hurricanes, polar bears, health care, education, retirement, etc) So there goes any “fiscal conservatism”, too.

Individual liberty? This year’s Heller decision was a victory in that regard, but not directly from a President (but via Supreme Court). Imminent domain powers seem to grow each passing year though.

Jeff, you are analytical and precise. So, let’s hear it sometime: Who is THE “conservative” you’d vote for (real or imagined)?

1. I’ve always felt that was a two part question. I am socially liberal, but conservative on the economy, national defense and foreign policy. So that’s a qualified yes.

2. Absolutely and it’s been my plan since he announced his candidacy. He was also my guy in 2000.

3. I think a Republican POTUS will have limited option with a Democratic Congress. What he can accomplish will be foreign policy (conservative), judgeships (pro-life) and supportive of the military.

4. No, as I said he was always my pick. However, pretty much any of the other nominees would have secured my vote against Obama (excepting Huckabee and Ron Paul).

I believe Obama is dangerous, but I wouldn’t take the vote-against theory too much farther down the line.

My decision is based on a couple very simple questiona.
1.Which of the two men will our enemies FEAR?

2.Which of the two men, if elected, will cause our enemies around the world to dance in the streets in celebration?

Maggie, thanks for the input. Looks like McCain is a great match for you.

Richard, that’s good anecdotal evidence for McCain, but anecdotal is as much as I’ll give it. I base decisions on my own principles, not the opposite principles of America’s enemies.

Maybe I’m missing something in Richard’s comments, here, but using those criterion *only* seems to point me to voting for Obama.

I’d question that our enemies (assuming, of course, that we’re talking about Al-Qaeda) are actually afraid of either of the candidates, since they’re trying to achieve martyrdom anyway. Furthermore, it seems to me that Al-Qaeda’s goal has been to bog the American military down in as many wars as possible, then voting for the candidate that wants to bomb Iran may be precisely what they want me to do.